Re: LVS, load balancing, and stickness was ==> Re: [Serusers] moreusrloc synchronization

Greger, I am not an expert on anycast as well. I just know it exists and people are starting to look at it more seriously for HA option. That is why I though DNS SRV records would be an easier solution. Regarding your comments on NAT, I don't believe it is an issue as it relates to forking proxy. Forking proxy should not resolve NAT, it is a job for its peers. As for configuring SER as forking proxy, I thought I read about it a while back, but now I can't seem to locate it. I hope I was not dreaming ;-). In any case, I will continue to google around to see if SER has this option. Sincerely, Alex From: Greger V. Teigre [mailto:greger@teigre.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2005 6:21 AM To: Alex Vishnev; serusers(a)lists.iptel.org Subject: Re: LVS, load balancing,and stickness was ==> Re: [Serusers] moreusrloc synchronization Alex, I'm not really knowledgable enough about anycast to say anything useful. The only is that in your described setup, I cannot really see how you get around the UA behind restricted (or worse) NAT. I have never tried to configure SER as a forking proxy, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was possible. g-) ---- Original Message ---- From: Alex Vishnev To: serusers(a)lists.iptel.org Sent: Monday, April 11, 2005 02:30 PM Subject: RE: LVS, load balancing, and stickness was ==> Re: [Serusers] moreusrloc synchronization > Greger and Paul, > > I think you understood me correctly regarding forking proxy. It is > the proxy that will fork out the requests to all available peering > proxies. This approach does not require stickiness based on Call-id. > AFAIK, once the forking proxy receives an acknowledgement from one of > its peers, then the rest of the session will be done directly to that > peer without the use of the forking proxy. I am considering 2 > approaches to resolve availability of forking proxy. 1 – using > ANYCAST (good high level article: > http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2003/12/31/173152/86). 2 – using dns > srv. I am still trying to determine if ANYCAST is a good solution for > creating local RPs with forking proxy. However, I think that dns srv > records can easily be implemented to allow simple round robin between > multiple forking proxies. Thoughts? > > Alex > > > > > From: serusers-bounces(a)iptel.org [mailto:serusers-bounces@lists.iptel.org] > On Behalf Of Greger V. Teigre > Sent: Monday, April 11, 2005 4:47 AM > To: kramarv(a)yahoo.com > Cc: serusers(a)lists.iptel.org > Subject: LVS, load balancing, and stickness was ==> Re: [Serusers] > more usrloc synchronization > > After my last email, I looked at ktcpvs and realized I ignored a > couple of things: ktcpvs only supports tcp (http is obviously > tcp-based, but I thought it supported udp for other protocols). I > don't know how much work implementing udp would be. > Here is a discussion of SIP and LVS that I found useful (though > not encouraging). >

> > Paul: I'm starting to get really curious on the standard LVS > components used for your stickiness! I'm not aware (also after > searching now) of an LVS balancing mechanism that allows correct > stickness on SIP udp...! > And I found other too who are looking for it: >

> > My understanding is that ipvs must be extended (according to the > developer) with a call-id based scheduler and that this work has > several people willing to fund development, but that this has not(?) > started yet. The problem is that ipvs is based on ip header analysis > and extending the hashing algorithms to also include payload-based > analysis is not straight-forward. > g-) > >> With regards to stickiness: Have you looked at ktcpvs? SIP is an >> "http-like" protocol and I'm pretty sure that you can use the >> http-based regex hashing to search for Call-Id. If you cannot use >> it right out of the box, I'm pretty sure the modifications are >> minimal. The user location problem: With a cluster back-end, I >> also only >> see save_memory() as the only option. >> g-) >> >>> "Greger V. Teigre" <greger(a)teigre.com> wrote: >>>> Greger, thanks a lot. >>>> The problem with load balancer is that replies goes to the wrong >>>> server due to rewriting outgoing a.b.c.d . BTW, as Paul pointed, >>>> if you define some dummy interface with Virtual IP (VIP), there >>>> is no need to rewrite outgoing messages (I tested this a little). >>> >>> >>> Yes, if you use LVS with direct routing or tunneling, that is what >>> you experience. >>> ===Of course. That why I implemented small "session" stickness. >>> However, it causes additional internal traffic. >>> >>> What I described was a "generic" SIP-aware load balancer where SIP >>> messages would be rewritten and stickiness implemented based on ex. >>> UA IP address (or call-id like vovida's load balancer). >>> ====Sure, it's better solution; I think we'll go this way soon (in >>> our next version). >>> >>>> Why DNS approach is bad (except restricted NAT - let's say I am >>>> solving this)? >>> >>> Well, IMO, DNS SRV in itself is not bad. It's just that many user >>> clients do not support DNS SRV yet. Except that, I like the >>> concept and it will give you a geographical redundancy and load >>> balancing. ===I am trying to build the following architecture: >>> >>> DNS (returns domain's public IP)->LVS+tunneling (Virtual IP)->ser >>> clusters (with private IPs) >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> DB >>> (MySQL 4.1 cluster) >>> >>>> I guess, Paul utilizes load-balancer scenario you have described. >>>> Believe there are only proprietary solutions for >>>> "the-replies-problem". We tried Vovida call-id-persistence >>>> package, unfortunately it didn't work for us. >>> >>> Are you referring to the load balancer proxy? IMHO, the SIP-aware >>> load balancer makes things a bit messy. It sounds to me that the >>> LVS + tunneling/direct routing + virtual IP on dummy adapter is a >>> better solution. >>> >>>> In my configuration I use shared remote DB cluster (with >>>> replication). Each ser see it as one-public-IP (exactly the >>>> approach you named for SIP). May be it's good idea to use local DB >>>> clusters, but if you have more than 2 servers your replication >>>> algorythm gonna be complex. Additional problem - it still doesn't >>>> solve usrloc synchronization - you still have to use >>>> t_replicate()... >>> >>> >>> I'm not sure if I understand. >>> ===Oh, probably I expressed myself not well enough... >>> >>> So, you have 2 servers at two location, each location with a shared >>> DB and then replication across an IPsec tunnel?? >>> IMHO, mysql 3.23.x two-way replication is quite shaky and >>> dangerous to rely on. With no locking, you will easily get >>> overwrites and you have to be very sure that your application >>> doesn't mess up the DB. I haven't looked at mysql 4.1 clustering, >>> but from the little I have seen, it looks good. Is that what you >>> use? >>> >>> ===We have 2 or more servers with MysQL 4.1 virtual server >>> (clusters balanced by LVS). We use MySQL for maintaining >>> subscribers' accounts, not for location. User location is still >>> in-memory only so far. I am afraid I have to switch to ser 09 in >>> order to use save_memory (thanks Paul!) and forward_tcp() for >>> replication. >>> >>>> With regard to t_replicate() - it doesn't work for more than 2 >>>> servers, so I used exactly forward_tcp() and save_noreply() >>>> (you're absolutely right - this works fine so far); all sers are >>>> happy. Of course, this causes additional traffic. Interesting >>>> whether Paul's FIFO patch reduces traffic between sers? >>> >>> I believe Paul uses forward_tcp() and save_memory() to save the >>> location to the replicated server's memory, while the >>> save("location") on the primary server will store to the DB (which >>> then replicates on the DB level). >>> g-) >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Do you Yahoo!? >>> Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site! > > > > _______________________________________________ > Serusers mailing list > serusers(a)lists.iptel.org > http://lists.iptel.org/mailman/listinfo/serusers