Hello all,
Now I got a question: I understand that sometimes, when a UAC droppes out of the internet, a BYE message will be lost. But, if I were to use Openser as a Carrier switch, this is NOT supposed to happen, right? as all VoIP Carriers MUST be on the internet permanently.
Any thoughts?
David
Hola David,
Now I got a question: I understand that sometimes, when a UACdroppes out of the internet, a BYE message will be lost. But, if I were to use Openser as a Carrier switch, this is NOT supposed to happen, right? as all VoIP Carriers MUST be on the internet permanently.
Any thoughts?
Yes. Some times things break, internet connectivity is lost, backbone loops happen, etc, etc...
Saludos JesusR.
------------------------------------ Jesus Rodriguez VozTelecom Sistemas, S.L. jesusr@voztele.com http://www.voztele.com Tel. 902360305 -------------------------------------
Then...
Excuse my asking: What IS the point of doing accounting with openser, if it will never be accurate?
david
On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 5:15 PM, Jesus Rodriguez jesusr@voztele.com wrote:
Hola David,
Now I got a question: I understand that sometimes, when a UAC droppesout of the internet, a BYE message will be lost. But, if I were to use Openser as a Carrier switch, this is NOT supposed to happen, right? as all VoIP Carriers MUST be on the internet permanently.
Any thoughts?
Yes. Some times things break, internet connectivity is lost, backbone loops happen, etc, etc...
Saludos JesusR.
Jesus Rodriguez VozTelecom Sistemas, S.L. jesusr@voztele.com http://www.voztele.com Tel. 902360305
El Jueves, 12 de Junio de 2008 16:38, David Villasmil escribió:
Then...
Excuse my asking: What IS the point of doing accounting with openser,if it will never be accurate?
david
Hi David, you should not rely only on OpenSer to do accounting, if you are doing so .. you are in troubles.
In a normal scenario, accounting and billing is done taking information from different sources and crosschecking it.
Hola,
El Jueves, 12 de Junio de 2008 16:38, David Villasmil escribió:
Then...
Excuse my asking: What IS the point of doing accounting withopenser, if it will never be accurate?
david
Hi David, you should not rely only on OpenSer to do accounting, if you are doing so .. you are in troubles.
In a normal scenario, accounting and billing is done taking information from different sources and crosschecking it.
In fact the best place to obtain the accounting are the gateways (if you own/manage them) but every time is more common to use third party gateways and they usually do not send accounting to external "collectors".
Saludos JesusR.
------------------------------------ Jesus Rodriguez VozTelecom Sistemas, S.L. jesusr@voztele.com http://www.voztele.com Tel. 902360305 -------------------------------------
Hola David,
Then...
Excuse my asking: What IS the point of doing accounting withopenser, if it will never be accurate?
The implementation of different "keepalive" methods like Session Timers, OPTIONS in-dialog, stop receiving RTP (some gateways like Cisco AS5xxx have an option to send a BYE if RTP is not received after some specific time period), etc.
Yes, SIP was not designed keeping accounting in mind :-/
Saludos JesusR.
On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 5:15 PM, Jesus Rodriguez jesusr@voztele.com wrote: Hola David,
Now I got a question: I understand that sometimes, when a UACdroppes out of the internet, a BYE message will be lost. But, if I were to use Openser as a Carrier switch, this is NOT supposed to happen, right? as all VoIP Carriers MUST be on the internet permanently.
Any thoughts?
Yes. Some times things break, internet connectivity is lost, backbone loops happen, etc, etc...
Saludos JesusR.
Jesus Rodriguez VozTelecom Sistemas, S.L. jesusr@voztele.com http://www.voztele.com Tel. 902360305
Users mailing list Users@lists.openser.org http://lists.openser.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/users
Saludos JesusR.
------------------------------------ Jesus Rodriguez VozTelecom Sistemas, S.L. jesusr@voztele.com http://www.voztele.com Tel. 902360305 -------------------------------------
El Thursday 12 June 2008 17:38:35 David Villasmil escribió:
Then...
Excuse my asking: What IS the point of doing accounting with openser,if it will never be accurate?
That's not true. If you use OpenSer + Radius ACC + MediaProxy + CDRTool (optional) you can get 99% accurate: if a UAC hangs down then it will not send a BYE but neither RTP so MediaProxy will detect it and update vía Radius or SQL.
Other way is using OpenSer ACC in conjunction with a B2BUA or gateways supporting Session Timers. In this case, if the UAC crashes it will not respond to the re-INVITE/UPDATE and the B2BUA/gateway will send a BYE so OpenSer will account the session properly.
AFAIK those are the existintg ACC ways using accounting into a proxy.
On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 5:51 PM, Iñaki Baz Castillo ibc@in.ilimit.es wrote:
El Thursday 12 June 2008 17:38:35 David Villasmil escribió:
Then...
Excuse my asking: What IS the point of doing accounting withopenser,
if it will never be accurate?
That's not true. If you use OpenSer + Radius ACC + MediaProxy + CDRTool (optional) you can get 99% accurate: if a UAC hangs down then it will not send a BYE but neither RTP so MediaProxy will detect it and update vía Radius or SQL.
Other way is using OpenSer ACC in conjunction with a B2BUA or gateways supporting Session Timers. In this case, if the UAC crashes it will not respond to the re-INVITE/UPDATE and the B2BUA/gateway will send a BYE so OpenSer will account the session properly.
AFAIK those are the existintg ACC ways using accounting into a proxy.
In which case, we STILL depend on a third party NOT BEING openser...
Just a question:
Is there any plan to implement this? i.e. sending an OPTIONS to the UACs to make sure they are online whilst in a call and ending the dialog if there is not answer?
david
El Thursday 12 June 2008 18:03:26 David Villasmil escribió:
Just a question:
Is there any plan to implement this? i.e. sending an OPTIONS to the UACs to make sure they are online whilst in a call and ending the dialog if there is not answer?
IMHO OpenSer is a very good SIP stateful proxy. Its aim is not being a call-stateful proxy. Managing dialogs is more expensive (RAM, CPU) than managing individual transactions so I'm not sure if OpenSer should control dialog status. But of course it's just my opinion.
El Jueves, 12 de Junio de 2008 17:03, David Villasmil escribió:
In which case, we STILL depend on a third party NOT BEING openser...
That is because with ONLY a proxy, you could not do accurate accounting, thats all.
Just a question:
Is there any plan to implement this? i.e. sending an OPTIONS to the UACs to make sure they are online whilst in a call and ending the dialog if there is not answer?
That will not give you accurate results, as Jesus said "SIP was not developed thinking on accounting", so .. for doing accounting with SIP you need to use a bunch of tools together.
Why you don't want to use RTPProxies ?, I insists that if you do not control de RTP path .. you could not do accurate accounting only with the signaling path, not without having a lot of complains from your customers .. :-)
El Thursday 12 June 2008 18:15:07 Raúl Alexis Betancor Santana escribió:
Why you don't want to use RTPProxies ?, I insists that if you do not control de RTP path .. you could not do accurate accounting only with the signaling path, not without having a lot of complains from your customers ..
Imagine a bad SIP phone that replies 200 OK when receiving an in-dialog OPTIONS even if the dialog doesn't exist. There are too much bad SIP devices in the world to rely *just* on SIP signalling for accounting purposes.
Hola,
El Thursday 12 June 2008 18:15:07 Raúl Alexis Betancor Santana escribió:
Why you don't want to use RTPProxies ?, I insists that if you do not control de RTP path .. you could not do accurate accounting only with the signaling path, not without having a lot of complains from your customers ..
Imagine a bad SIP phone that replies 200 OK when receiving an in- dialog OPTIONS even if the dialog doesn't exist. There are too much bad SIP devices in the world to rely *just* on SIP signalling for accounting purposes.
Or other UA that answer with a 404 or 500 or 503 if the dialog exists or not.
This thread seems the "spanish army" accounting support :-)
Saludos JesusR.
------------------------------------ Jesus Rodriguez VozTelecom Sistemas, S.L. jesusr@voztele.com http://www.voztele.com Tel. 902360305 -------------------------------------
I was hoping that Bodgan would chip on this conversation...
:S
On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 6:34 PM, Iñaki Baz Castillo ibc@in.ilimit.es wrote:
El Thursday 12 June 2008 18:25:28 Jesus Rodriguez escribió:
This thread seems the "spanish army" accounting support :-)
Doesn't exist a OpenSer spanish maillist? XDDDDD What are we doing here speaking between us in English? XD
-- Iñaki Baz Castillo ibc@in.ilimit.es
Users mailing list Users@lists.openser.org http://lists.openser.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/users
On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 5:51 PM, Iñaki Baz Castillo ibc@in.ilimit.es wrote:
El Thursday 12 June 2008 17:38:35 David Villasmil escribió:
Then...
Excuse my asking: What IS the point of doing accounting withopenser,
if it will never be accurate?
That's not true. If you use OpenSer + Radius ACC + MediaProxy + CDRTool (optional) you can get 99% accurate: if a UAC hangs down then it will not send a BYE but neither RTP so MediaProxy will detect it and update vía Radius or SQL.
Other way is using OpenSer ACC in conjunction with a B2BUA or gateways supporting Session Timers. In this case, if the UAC crashes it will not respond to the re-INVITE/UPDATE and the B2BUA/gateway will send a BYE so OpenSer will account the session properly.
True, But this will also bring the added cost of handling rtps, right?
AFAIK those are the existintg ACC ways using accounting into a proxy.
On Thursday 12 June 2008, David Villasmil wrote:
Then...
Excuse my asking: What IS the point of doing accounting with openser,if it will never be accurate?
Hi,
i would be really glad if you could sell me a 100% accurate accounting solution. ;-) In real world scenarios there will be everytime an error present, the size depends of course on the work/ money you want to invest. If you have a sufficient large userbase, even sporadic and small errors will be add up, and need to be handled from the customer support.
Cheers,
Henning
David Villasmil wrote:
Then...
Excuse my asking: What IS the point of doing accounting withopenser, if it will never be accurate?
Just because someone wrote an accounting module for OpenSER, doesn't mean it will be accurate or complete.
I do all my accounting via my media gateways - Then I know if media is not flowing then we should not be getting charged or not charging anyone else for any given call.
Jeremy McNamara
-
David Villasmil -
Henning Westerholt -
Iñaki Baz Castillo -
Jeremy McNamara -
Jesus Rodriguez -
Raúl Alexis Betancor Santana